Roleplay and You

[Twist of Cain]

PvP then becomes final and allows much to easy griefing and favors whoever launches the first strike.

PvP has always been that way, but Karma's a bitch. I would not want to see it in place on a server that doesn't have a fair establishment of good RPers already, but the more people that are around who really care about the story, the better it becomes.

I definitely would not have gone that way as I tend to invest in one major character, and losing that character would, in effect, drive me from Dasaria. ESPECIALLY if applied retroactively.

You'll find in systems like the ones I described that PvP is altogether much more rare and, when it happens, much more epic. Yes, there are people who cannot handle a character and their story coming to an end, but for a realistic resolution to conflict, it is superior. PvP doesn't always have to be final, either. And the servers I saw this on also had a "subdual mode" for non-death PvPing, which was the default damage mode upon log-in. For the story it is a good thing, when you are in a group of other good role-players. (And that is the goal, after all.) Compare ending 1,

"And then the villain tried to stab the paladin in the back after a few minutes of plotting against him, but the paladin turned around and chopped off his head. So the villain respawned and was like "omg I get u next time" and ran away."

to

"And then the villain tried to stab the paladin in the back after weeks of plotting against him, but the paladin turned around and chopped off his head. The villainous villain never robbed people again, and for the rest of his life, the paladin was known as Arthur the Villain-Chopper."

[No PvP in front of guards except with DM supervision] is simply not feasible. Our DMs are already stretched thin, and having to have them around to police PvP is not something they like to handle. I know it adds a layer of realism, but logistically speaking, it's next to impossible to ask that of them.

It's entirely possible, we're not asking the DMs to obey these rules but the players. PvP is already logged, just add the location. And don't attack someone right next to a guard as if he were a dumb, brainless NPC, even if you know he is. If you absolutely must, do it when a DM is around. Seriously, who kills people in front of the cops? Just completely ignoring NPC guards is horribly OOC, I'm sorry.

I understand the desire for this, [restricting access to PrCs] but again, I disagree. It adds another layer of difficulty onto managing for the DMs, and also makes it so that people can't build their characters as they want. [...] it weakens creativity in builds and drives off people who are more interested in just playing for fun and building as they see fit. We're not an elite RP server, we've always been open to all types of play-styles, and enforcing a single type of playstyle goes against everything Dasaria has done for years.

Creativity in builds is unrelated to creativity in roleplay (but it is an important component in powergaming.) As such, the rule (which can be easily enforced by scripts) creates rewards for good roleplayers by letting them be approved for PrCs. It's not mandatory, but is just another piece in a puzzle, and also puts the "prestige" back in "prestige class." Again, the question is what changes can be made to encourage roleplayers here, and the simplest answer is "reward pro-active roleplayers." This implies on some level you have to give them things non-roleplayers will not get.

As to wanting to see more dogmas, WRITE THEM and SUBMIT THEM to the DMs.

I'm not really as familiar with the server lore as I'd like to be, but perhaps a small reward would be good for those clerics who roleplay and submit material OOCly.

Keeping things artificially hard doesn't encourage RP, it just makes things hard.

Achieving something in a hard environment is much more rewarding than in a soft environment. It's that principle at work. I don't think it's a major point, but it can enhance a story. Contrast "Success! I achieved X, a unique accomplishment!" to "Success! I achieved X, ...which everyone else also has because it's just a matter of time, and easy." All in all, I don't think this is a "sticking point," but it's another piece of the puzzle.

I have no desire to see the DMs disqualifying and discriminating against people based on their builds.

Similar to restricting PrCs, it's more of a matter of how to "create" rewards for players (or not). A horribly min-maxed, optimized 6 cha half-orc should throw a flag up for DMs seeking out people to interact with and potentially reward. It's a flag that says, "this player might care more about winning than the story." If the half-orc in question role-plays his low cha/int well and to his character's detriment, that's another matter entirely. I'm not saying they should check the database for everyone with 6 charisma or whatever.

[DM spice] is always fun when it happens. Again, this ties back to our DMs being stretched thin. When they have the time to do so, great, but we gotta remember that they're people too, with lives and responsibilities.

I understand, I was just pointing out the various things I've noticed on excellent RP servers. So that doesn't really change the suggestion, it just adds the footnote to many of the suggestions, "Dasaria may need more active DMs."

There are factions for EVERYONE here, trust me, all with varying degrees of influence and power. The problem is right now many folks are not interested in joining pre-existing factions, they're interested in their own factions and plots. This is especially frustrating to those of us in faction who are involved in the main plots of the server, because it appears to us that people are more interested in doing their own thing than in Dasaria in general.

Maybe new people don't even know players are in factions? Not that I've been here long, but I've yet to see a single person IG advertising their established faction or trying to involve my characters in their established factions somehow. I'd be very interested in it if that happened, assuming it makes sense for my character. (One of them is somewhat involved in a newly starting faction. Why? Because they approached him, RPed about it and hired him for some tasks.) I'm not arguing with you, I'm just saying factions are so important... so maybe on Dasaria, DMs need to kinda kick-start the factions up somehow?

Due to the nature of the setting, players in major political roles in unlikely. There is a major guard faction on the server (the Fleet), which is inactive due to a sudden spurt of inactivity on their player's parts. Further, there is an Imperial Knight faction (the Argentum Vigilo) which is treated as part of the Imperial military and answers directly to the Crown Prince of the Varanite Empire. There's also the Church of Lochwar faction, which is also very political, being the favorite church of the Empire. A lot of it's in place, but people don't know/care about it.

What makes players in major political roles that unlikely? Anyway, it was just one example. The point is, why do you want recruits for your faction? Why do they want to join? What advantages will it give them, that they'd want to join? (Political power? Prestige? Some neat items with abilities? Being able to beat down people in the streets for littering? Etc.)

That is how major plots are already handled. The last major plot run by the DMs involved trying to save the Crown Prince's life. The DMs put a lot of the pieces in place and then let the players in the various factions handle it as they would. The Prince was eventually saved, but there was a lot of politicking, in-fighting and epic fights along the way (and the attitudes and desires expressed there are probably what led to the schism of the Argentum Vigilo into the AV and Daybreak). So this stuff is here, it's just been put on holdish for some reason...

Sounds good. I'd just like to see more of it.

[Mon-da-oth]

Rhode stood bewildered and confused covered in the blood and guts of a wyvern that appeared to have been mauled by a wild animal. He heard people approaching and he turned still trying to figure out where he was. One by one he recognized the members of the Argentum Vigilo and he recalled the secrets of each one as they gathered in a group on the hill above him. "You are a beast one of them called down to him." Of course he denied it. It was a ridiculous idea and they were just toying with him having caught him in a disadvantage.

Suddenly he found himself held firm. The translucent image of a giant hand held him in place. In his panic and confusion he call to the shadows and wrapped himself in their protection but then the Walls of Fire came down on him surrounding him on all sides. He twitched and dodged fighting against the spell the held him as he struggled to avoid the flames eating away at his clothing and flesh. With an effort he managed to move enough to avoid the flames as they scorched the grass behind him. "Come out of the shadows or I will burn you to ashes." He recognized the voice as that of the Lore Master Hyle.

He felt betrayed. Many times before he had aided the Knights and now they attacked him. He knew the truth that you can not trust anyone, not even yourself and this just proved what he practiced ever day of his life. It is what had kept him alive for so long. They like others had turned against him. His only way to remain safe and alive would be to eliminate each one, but first he had to hope the spell holding him would wear off before his new location was revealed.

This happened in game without any assistance from the DM's at the start. It was all player driven and lead to one of the most fun nights I have had in a long long time. RP does happen. There are people that do RP. Truthfully just about everyone involved in this encounter was a veteran but this could have happened to anyone who wanted to RP. You don't have to be a Veteran to RP!

What develops between Veterans is a sense of trust. We trust each other to respect that there is a human on the other side of the computer generated icon that represents our character and that we are all here to have fun. This makes it easier to RP with other Veterans but it does not that only Veterans are capable of if. There were at least two in this group that I have only come to know within the last few month. They proved themselves through interacting that they were interested in RPing and joined others that had the same interest.

You can request/demand that the DM's do more but the bottom line is that it is the players responsibility to provide the respect that allows RP to take place.

*special thanks to DM Wired for providing transportation and sound effects later during this encounter.*

[Evelond Formos]

[about pvp and other death-related issues]

I think that good roleplayers will roleplay PvP in a manner that is epic anyway. Enforcing this only discourages those who might later become good roleplayers from PvPing. We should keep this area loose.

[about PRCs and divine classes]

I have never been a fan of being bound to what's on my character sheet. Classes, to me, are entirely irrelevant to roleplay, unless they are actively connected by the player. Restricting things like these may filter a lot of ridiculousness, but it may also squander attempts at creativity.

Keeping things artificially hard doesn't encourage RP, it just makes things hard.

Achieving something in a hard environment is much more rewarding than in a soft environment. It's that principle at work. I don't think it's a major point, but it can enhance a story. Contrast "Success! I achieved X, a unique accomplishment!" to "Success! I achieved X, ...which everyone else also has because it's just a matter of time, and easy." All in all, I don't think this is a "sticking point," but it's another piece of the puzzle.

But things are already incredibly difficult on Dasaria for anyone that is not powerbuilt. I'm pretty sure this is intentional, as Dasaria's quests are meant for parties, for the most part. I'm not sure how you're equating "making things harder" with "making things more special". The people that can spend a lot of time on Das will inevitably figure out how to accomplish anything, quest-wise. Making things harder just hurts casual players.

I have no desire to see the DMs disqualifying and discriminating against people based on their builds.

Similar to restricting PrCs, it's more of a matter of how to "create" rewards for players (or not). A horribly min-maxed, optimized 6 cha half-orc should throw a flag up for DMs seeking out people to interact with and potentially reward. It's a flag that says, "this player might care more about winning than the story." If the half-orc in question role-plays his low cha/int well and to his character's detriment, that's another matter entirely. I'm not saying they should check the database for everyone with 6 charisma or whatever.

Again, I see no reason to bind characters to their character sheets. DnD isn't a great system, and nobody loves to die in quests. Min-maxing does not make one a bad roleplayer.

[political positions]

I would love to see this happen. I do not think that a PW can thrive unless players can earn positions of power.

Overall, I think more conflict is not only a good idea, but absolutely necessary for a healthy level of RP on the server. And not just conflict with the main villains of the campaign (NPCs), but political and actual fighting between player factions.

I also think that a lesser degree of attachment to one's characters is preferable to a greater degree of attachment. One must be willing to make sacrifices for the sake of the story.

EDIT: Also, woot. 2300th post.

I think an important thing to remember is that a character is sacred to his or her respective player. It is a bad idea to infringe upon that player's intellectual rights over that character. One's vision of a character is exactly that: one's own vision. The only person that decides what a character should be like is the player.

[DM Eumenides]

As much as we love to watch roleplayers and help them along when we're logged on, we absolutely adore it when people roleplay on their own. Remember, you don't always need a DM around to help you roleplay! That especially goes for factions. Oh, and those weekly playtimes that some players are a part of, whatever happened to logging in on random days? You never know what you could run into.

[Twist of Cain]

I think that good roleplayers will roleplay PvP in a manner that is epic anyway. Enforcing this only discourages those who might later become good roleplayers from PvPing. We should keep this area loose.

Ah, but I'm not talking about roleplaying PvP in a manner that is epic, I'm talking about roleplay storylines that are epic. The difference between A Neverending Story and Saving Private Ryan.

I should also point out that systems in which pvp defaults to subdual damage actually cause less loss due to pvp most of the time, since 'casual' pvp results in nothing except healing hps and ego back. "Full Damage" pvp becomes quite rare, but all pvp becomes edge of the seat... players who tend to FD without very good RP reason also find themselves at the FD end of the stick frequently, and things tend to right themselves.

I have never been a fan of being bound to what's on my character sheet. Classes, to me, are entirely irrelevant to roleplay, unless they are actively connected by the player. Restricting things like these may filter a lot of ridiculousness, but it may also squander attempts at creativity.

I don't see how the connection between a cleric and his god can ever be considered "irrelevant to roleplay." As far as PrC restriction goes, it's a way to draw the focus away from builds and towards rewarding pro-active roleplayers.

Again, I see no reason to bind characters to their character sheets. DnD isn't a great system, and nobody loves to die in quests. Min-maxing does not make one a bad roleplayer.

I'm sure you like your characters being bound to those parts of their sheets that let them cast awesome magic spells or use amazing combat feats. Now, I didn't mean to imply min-maxing means someone is a bad roleplayer, by itself. But the fact is, if someone min-maxes their half-orc to vegetable levels of int, wis and cha, and doesn't occasionally roleplay him doing genuinely, dangerously dumb things, or disadvantageous things, they simply are not roleplaying their character well. They're also being discourteous to roleplayers who, for instance, want to play an actually smart orc and actually put points in int, despite this impacting their mechanical gameplay negatively. I don't think this is way up on the list of priorities, but if DMs wish to encourage good RPers, things like this should be considered too. Naturally, some people may roleplay their low stats well. People with low stats aren't necessarily bad roleplayers.

[Evelond Formos]

I think that good roleplayers will roleplay PvP in a manner that is epic anyway. Enforcing this only discourages those who might later become good roleplayers from PvPing. We should keep this area loose.

Ah, but I'm not talking about roleplaying PvP in a manner that is epic, I'm talking about roleplay storylines that are epic. The difference between A Neverending Story and Saving Private Ryan.

So am I.

I have never been a fan of being bound to what's on my character sheet. Classes, to me, are entirely irrelevant to roleplay, unless they are actively connected by the player. Restricting things like these may filter a lot of ridiculousness, but it may also squander attempts at creativity.

I don't see how the connection between a cleric and his god can ever be considered "irrelevant to roleplay." As far as PrC restriction goes, it's a way to draw the focus away from builds and towards rewarding pro-active roleplayers.

The connection between a cleric and his god is not "irrelevant to roleplay"; however, it is that cleric's choice to determine the extent and nature of that connection. My beef is less with cleric restrictions, however, and more with Paladin ones. The assortment of abilities granted to those taking the paladin class do not give the impression of being limited strictly to lawful good characters, or characters that follow a strict, predefined "paladin's code". They are holy knights - so long as they act in the service of their god, I see no issue with a paladin being of any reasonable alignment.

Again, I see no reason to bind characters to their character sheets. DnD isn't a great system, and nobody loves to die in quests. Min-maxing does not make one a bad roleplayer.

I'm sure you like your characters being bound to those parts of their sheets that let them cast awesome magic spells or use amazing combat feats. Now, I didn't mean to imply min-maxing means someone is a bad roleplayer, by itself. But the fact is, if someone min-maxes their half-orc to vegetable levels of int, wis and cha, and doesn't occasionally roleplay him doing genuinely, dangerously dumb things, or disadvantageous things, they simply are not roleplaying their character well. They're also being discourteous to roleplayers who, for instance, want to play an actually smart orc and actually put points in int, despite this impacting their mechanical gameplay negatively. I don't think this is way up on the list of priorities, but if DMs wish to encourage good RPers, things like this should be considered too. Naturally, some people may roleplay their low stats well. People with low stats aren't necessarily bad roleplayers.

1. "But the fact is, if someone min-maxes their half-orc to vegetable levels of int, wis and cha, and doesn't occasionally roleplay him doing genuinely, dangerously dumb things, or disadvantageous things, they simply are not roleplaying their character well." Actually, that's not a fact. It does not follow that not roleplaying according to one's character sheet equates to "not roleplaying their character well". It only means that they have chosen to disregard their character sheet for the purposes of roleplaying their character concept. This could be for a variety of reasons. Perhaps they would rather not gimp their build simply to fulfill their RP concept. Your statement... Non sequitur.

2. "They're also being discourteous to roleplayers who, for instance, want to play an actually smart orc and actually put points in int, despite this impacting their mechanical gameplay negatively." No, they are not. It is a player's own choice to gimp their character's mechanical build to fulfill a roleplay concept, when that concept could be fulfilled independent of the character sheet. Honestly, calling a disregard for stats to IG abilities correlation a "discourtesy" is like calling me rude for not having the same religion or political beliefs as you.

3. "I'm sure you like your characters being bound to those parts of their sheets that let them cast awesome magic spells or use amazing combat feats." Actually, I don't. I would prefer to create my characters' abilities myself, rather than be bound to those included by Obsidian. Similarly, I would prefer to impair my characters as I see fit. (I do not create flawless characters, far from.) Unfortunately, NWN2 doesn't allow this. As such, I see no necessity in connecting character sheets to characters.

You seem to be under the impression that because I find nothing wrong with min-maxing, I must be a "min-maxer". You also seem to think I try to completely separate my character sheet from my character. Not so. My Fleetsman is roleplayed as having a decent amount of strength; so it is on his character sheet, too. My argument is simply that ones character sheet does not need to reflect one's character. Some of the best roleplayers I know have been min-maxers, or have played their characters contrary to some of their classes.

My apologies if I sound somewhat hostile in this post, I do not mean to. However, when I write long posts, I tend to get fiery.

[The Explorer]

Oh, and those weekly playtimes that some players are a part of, whatever happened to logging in on random days? You never know what you could run into.

Well I know a bunch including myself have RL interferences but; I stopped random logins during the week because it became pointless, login to RP when no one else was around or no Rpers, my chars that are not already max lvl need parties to adventure with, my chars that are max lvl there was no point doing loot runs to find decent equipment anymore because the loot pool was butchered months ago.

[izzul]

my chars that are max lvl there was no point doing loot runs to find decent equipment anymore because the loot pool was butchered months ago.

i'll always agree about The Explorer trying to express his "gratitude" to the butchered loot pool.. seems that he has been expressing this for months now... go go The Explorer!!!

[Twist of Cain]

Evelond, I feel that as a player one has a responsibility to play a character within the rules and definitions of the setting that you and the other players chose, and that includes the rules governing stats and what they mean. I don't see anything non-sequitur about the rules stating "Paladins depend on being lawful good," "Deities grant power and can withdraw them if they see fit - not you," or "That '6 int' there? That means intelligence, and your character is as dumb as they get."

On the other hand, if the DMs state, for example, "Deities don't care how many babies their clerics murder in their name," or "What's on your character's sheet can be ignored if you want to roleplay differently; hell, insist your halfling is a leprechaun with a pot of gold, and your half-orc with a horned helmet is 'really' a minotaur," well, house rules are another matter.

As far as storylines being epic in which two characters can beat each other up over and over with no chance of really dying, I'm having a hard time seeing that as nearly as "epic" as one in which a big confrontation will result in an ending with finality. Ho-hum, they'll be at it again tomorrow... but maybe I'll change my mind about this as I play here longer. At least it seems more relaxed.

[Redleafe]

As far as storylines being epic in which two characters can beat each other up over and over with no chance of really dying, I'm having a hard time seeing that as nearly as "epic" as one in which a big confrontation will result in an ending with finality. Ho-hum, they'll be at it again tomorrow... but maybe I'll change my mind about this as I play here longer. At least it seems more relaxed.

Well I suppose the mechanics here within Dasaria don't aid to realism in matters of death but obviously the players who are involved in PvP conflict can come to some sort of agreement, perhaps no conflict for a month real time, or some other arrangement. I understand ToC your desire to bring out the "epic" in conflict and or battle all together but the prospect of permadeath is harsh, especially to a player who might have very limited time as it is. I personally think that death should have a steeper penalty here in Dasaria, the exact numbers I'm not positive on, it could be something discussed.

The idea of players collaborating through a storyline to kill off a player in the result of the loss through combat is a very proactive way to capture the "epic" feel, it has been done and surely isn't beyond us down the road.

[superpoweredchimp]

I tend to not consider a PvP death as actual death, but being knocked unconscious, or something similar.


Explorer, I think that's what Eumenides was pointing out. Roleplayers log on, don't see any other roleplayers on, then log off, leaving the server to have... no roleplayers on. It's a very obvious loop that even I'm guilty of. And even if there are other roleplayers on, sometimes it's hard to know where they're at. They could be in the Vissen, having a good time, but North Cear could be completely empty, leaving people to assume that everyone else is out doing quests.

[stoned-raider]

I am one of those that have recently been discouraged from logging into Das. I went over to another server instead (which I won't name here). A lot of things are handled different there, and I'm sure some of those things would help increasing the quantity-level on Das (note: Not the quality-level, as that is just fine )

1. Automated RP-xp
This is a lovely feature, it will give you chunks of 50xp every once in a while. The chance is increased if you type things, or are around other PCs. Spending two hours around the campfire might get you a few hundred xp this way ( hardly ever more than 200-300 per hour). That is not much, but it gives you the chance to progress in levels even if you hardly go out adventuring. Of course a sytem like this -might- be abused by someone going afk and still getting xp, but there's always the chance to make that player lose xp/levels/gear/ the right to play (aka ban).

2. A scrying/player-find-tool
Especially with the size of Das at it's current state, finding someone can be really hard. Of course you can send tells to everyone and ask them if they're up for some RP, but this tool is just a lot easier to use. Especially if you don't know the players/PCs that are on

3. Reduce (or remove) quest xp! *runs and hides*
If someone can easily make 2-3000 xp (and hey, probably you can make even more) a day simply by running a few quests, chance is they will do just that. Run through the quests as fast as possible and make mass xp. I know almost everyone here will disagree with that point, because yes, you can do quests and still RP along the way. But be honest if you're running the Kalem for the tenth time, followed by Bugbears and then over to Morell ... the RP suffers. I for myself found that with a lower xp-gain through killing stuff (or doing quests) people tend to RP more. Another possibility would be making all quests just once per character, non-repeatable. Leveling would take definitely take longer this way, but automated RP-xp might make up for this partially.

4. Make the OOC chatter rule a hard & enforced one
It is really not so hard to keep OOC chatter to a minimum (or preferably to tells). It adds a lot to the athmosphere and has no drawbacks at all. I've seen DMs give out xp for good roleplay ... why not dock some xp for constant OOC-chatter (acompanied with a friendly tell that explains the sudden loss of xp).

5. Same as above in regard to ignoring NPCs
NPCs are are as much part of the story as PCs are. If you PvP someone right in front of the guards, that is just bad style (or a stupid PC). It happened to me and the worst of all: The guy that killed me even stayed around continuing his bullying, while all the guards stood there idly watching us. This truely ruined the athmosphere for me and I logged shortly after. This could both be punished OOC (docking levels/xp) or IC ( suddenly a fully buffed fleetsman Codzilla shows up and hunts down the attacker). Both would make think people twice about ignoring NPCs in the future.

6.Make it a hard rule to play out your stats (the high AND the low ones)
If someone has an int of 6 and talks like a fantasy-Einstein, dock him/her some xp. Reward it if they actually play out being stupid like a brick. Again any form of docking xp should be acompanied with a friendly expaining tell.


I know that points 4,5 and 6 might be hard to implement because it would be more work for DMs. But I belive that doing this once in a while would have a good overall effect.
Yeah ... that was my two cents on the matter.

[Rob]

Mahatma Gandhi said, "Be the change you want to see in the world." If you love role-playing on Dasaria, then you have to take an active role in encouraging it. Here's what I plan to do.

I will create believable characters with specific goals. My characters will seek out allies to help them achieve their goals while hindering characters with opposing goals. I will do this within the framework of the D&D rule set, Dasaria's server rules and lore, and with respect for my fellow players.

I will promote immersion by staying in character at all times. I will never speak out of character in a public channel.

I understand that not everyone who plays on Dasaria comes from a role playing background. I will encourage these people to role play through example. If they engage in out of character behavior in a public channel I will politely remind them to respect the immersion of others and to take their out of character banter to a private channel.

For role playing to thrive, it has to come from the player. When you have hundreds of players, there's only so much a few DMs can do.

[Evelond Formos]

Evelond, I feel that as a player one has a responsibility to play a character within the rules and definitions of the setting that you and the other players chose, and that includes the rules governing stats and what they mean. I don't see anything non-sequitur about the rules stating "Paladins depend on being lawful good," "Deities grant power and can withdraw them if they see fit - not you," or "That '6 int' there? That means intelligence, and your character is as dumb as they get."

See, though, responsibility only comes willingly. NWN2 is far less flexible than, say, PnP, which can be shifted as a group of players and a DM see fit to make the game more enjoyable. Nobody agreed to the set list of classes or abilities that comes with NWN2. That's just what we've been given. We have no further say in the matter, other than to vote with our feet. Accordingly, a given player has no responsibility to adhere to it.

I would not be making this argument were it not for the fact that I love Dasaria for its story and its community, but I absolutely hate DnD (or rather, the default implementation of DnD). It is anathema to my creative juices. The fact is that it is the only platform appropriate for something like Dasaria at the moment, though.

On the other hand, if the DMs state, for example, "Deities don't care how many babies their clerics murder in their name," or "What's on your character's sheet can be ignored if you want to roleplay differently; hell, insist your halfling is a leprechaun with a pot of gold, and your half-orc with a horned helmet is 'really' a minotaur," well, house rules are another matter.

Dasaria has always been lax regarding character concepts. Hell, I believe there was a Klingon in Dasaria 1. I'm not saying that these concepts, when given freedom, are never lame. Very often, they are. However, quality is evident to those of quality. This kind of stuff does not need to be enforced because there already exists a safeguard against ridiculousness: storyline support. Neither DMs nor players will support a storyline they find absolutely ridiculous. They will, however, know and support quality RP when they see it.

As far as storylines being epic in which two characters can beat each other up over and over with no chance of really dying, I'm having a hard time seeing that as nearly as "epic" as one in which a big confrontation will result in an ending with finality. Ho-hum, they'll be at it again tomorrow... but maybe I'll change my mind about this as I play here longer. At least it seems more relaxed.

Permadeath has been a result of PvP on Dasaria in the past, but this has always been agreed on prior to the confrontation by the players involved. As far as I know, all of these instances of PvP with final consequences were enjoyed by all involved. Due to the nature of these agreements, however, trust among the participants was required.

My point is that the epic storylines you are imagining will and do arise on their own. Forcing players to either avoid "serious" PvP or face the possibility of permadeath will not cause them to engage in heavy storylines more, it will only cause them to avoid PvP. This is solely a matter of maturity, and maturity cannot be forced.

On another note, a lot of the ideas being mentioned seem to be aimed at discouraging non-RPers. Dasaria does not strictly enforce in-character interactions. The idea, in my opinion, should not be to discourage OOCness, but to encourage RP.

[Mad Dog Reno]

Mahatma Gandhi said, "Be the change you want to see in the world."

Heh and its again true and very simpple? If want some change so best way is to be example to others? All complaining dont help in the end?