The Big List Of Spells

[Wyvern]

At 2d6/missile, I think 120 damage/maxed IGMS will hurt almost anyone. Given the fact that currently we have 1d6/missile in Das 1 (I think) but all 20 can hit, you are looking at the same damage output for the spell on a single target.

That is under the assumption that we dont reduce the damage to 1d6/missile in Das 2, in which case it will halve the damage to 60/cast.

[Vahene]

At 2d6/missile, I think 120 damage/maxed IGMS will hurt almost anyone. Given the fact that currently we have 1d6/missile in Das 1 (I think) but all 20 can hit, you are looking at the same damage output for the spell on a single target.

That is under the assumption that we dont reduce the damage to 1d6/missile in Das 2, in which case it will halve the damage to 60/cast.

60 is a lot more reasonable, in my opinion than 120. With 120, any elf is nearly dead due to low HPs, not to mention any other mage you might get lucky to nail without spells.. they're corpses.

-K

[Wyvern]

I think it depends on whether a save is made for each missile or not. If, for example, a reflex save is done for each missile, I would say leave it at 2d6/missile. Remember maximised chain lightning (which sits at the same spell level I think) can dish out 120 damage which has a reflex save attached to it.

But as IGMS currently stands, those missiles will hit with no save (someone correct me if I'm wrong on this, I dont have the spell description available right now) and there is a hell of a difference between 120 damage guaranteed and maybe getting 120, or even a small percentage of that maximum, depending on someones reflex save.

[Vahene]

I think it depends on whether a save is made for each missile or not. If, for example, a reflex save is done for each missile, I would say leave it at 2d6/missile. Remember maximised chain lightning (which sits at the same spell level I think) can dish out 120 damage which has a reflex save attached to it.

But as IGMS currently stands, those missiles will hit with no save (someone correct me if I'm wrong on this, I dont have the spell description available right now) and there is a hell of a difference between 120 damage guaranteed and maybe getting 120, or even a small percentage of that maximum, depending on someones reflex save.

It has no save now, a reflex save (at least) would be a godsend.

-K

[Peregrinus]

Last tme I used IGMS on Dasaria it was as follows:

2d6 Magic damage per missile
1 missile/level
No saving throw
Missiles will divide themselves evenly among all hostile targets.

As to what they've done to it in NWN2, I'd have to see the description. If it holds to the NWN style of saving throws, assuming it has one (which I doubt, but I'll get to that in a moment), then it will be a save against each missile. As to it even having a save, that would be unlikely if the programmers are even doing anything resembling DnD. IGMS and ILMS are both suppost to be Magic Missile's big brothers. In PnP, MM does Force type damage, which generally has no saving throw (you merely take the damage). By extension, I doubt they'll impliment any save on the Missile Storm spells.

As it stands, Disintergrate will be the Elf and Rogue killer, 40D6 at level 20 with a fort save for 5D6. IGMS will be better against hordes of enemies who you want some assured damage against or who are too spread out for fireballs to be effective against.

[lankycheese]

Disintergrate will be the Elf and Rogue killer

Elves can have high fort too.

So it's a straight save or 240 damage when maximised spell? Skill ftw eh?

[Grayle]

Disintegrate requires a successful ranged touch attack to hit, before the saving throw...at least, in pen & paper.

[Wyvern]

Code: Select all

        5.1.6.3.2	Disintegrate (B)
        PHB, pg. 222
        School:		Transmutation
        Components: 	Verbal, Somatic
        Range:		Medium
        Target:		Ray
        Duration:		Instantaneous
        Saving Throw:	Fortitude partial
        Spell Resist:	Yes

        This requires a ranged touch attack to hit. Any creature hit takes 2d6 
        hit points of damage per caster level (to a maximum of 40d6). Any creature 
        reduced to 0 hit points or less is entirely disintegrated. If the target 
        makes their fortitude saves, they only take 5d6 damage.
        [Art] For this spell to work we need a disintegration effect or some sort 
        of procedural effect that would mimic it. It would have to work for any hostile target.

        [Rules Note] In 3.5 you can also disintegrate objects, but that's not really possible in NWN2.

[lankycheese]

The touch attack makes it awesome then.

[Grayle]

Yeah, at least it's not IWIN, but the attack roll still ignores armor. Good thing Mages' AB isn't very good.

[Wyvern]

A Truestrike/Disintegrate combo might be fairly effective.

[lankycheese]

Now that will be a nifty little combo, but maybe it'll be just enough time to close in for that silence. ^^ I can't wait to start crossing hands again!

Now another question, haste. It says it gives an extra attack per round, does that count as an extra spell per round too? I was under the impression they were changing it so it wouldn't do that. As 2 spells in the space of 1 is a lot more potent then 1 extra melee/bow attack.

[Grayle]

Haste is only supposed to grant an extra attack a round for those persons using the full attack option for that round. It does not actually grant a second action. So, no, it is not supposed to allow two spells to be cast in a single round.

Of course, again, I am referencing P & P.

[KoolestLoser]

I read somewhere it does not give a caster an extra spell. I think Pere stated it somewhere earlier.

[Peregrinus]

If they do haste according to PnP rules, then it will only grant an extra attack, plus to move speed, and +1 Dodge bonus to AC.

Also, keep in mind that ranged touch also means CRITICAL HITS!*

So, it is possible for a Maximized Disintergrate to deal 480 Damage... *eg* Further, fortitude partial means that it'll still deal damage, just 5d6 (or 30 Maximized).

The touch attacks are going to be a tough area to balance for mages. In PnP, the vast majority of AC comes from Armors, Shields and Natural Armor bonuses, all these are ignored by Touch attacks. In NWNs you got a lot of bonuses from other sources, even in Dasaria. Hopefully, they balanced treasure right and did AC scripting right so that touch attacks are not totally screwed over by items that give dodge bonuses (which don't exsist in PnP) and huge deflection bonuses. Rogues will still be a bitch to hit for mages, but there are ways around that.

Hey, DMs, are there "Weapon Focus: Touch" and/or "Weapon Focus: Ray" in NWN2? Also, looks like mages might just begin buffing their Dex and taking Weapon Finesse for their touch attacks... hrm... that definately calls for new plans for the next sorcerer I play.

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*This is, of course, assuming they hold strictly to PnP rules, where anything that has an attack roll can crit.