Dasaria II - A NWN2 Roleplay and Story-driven Persistent World

Most successful servers I have been on in NWN1 added some feature that made adventuring necessary even at the level cap. Here, I think we can also solved ECL all at the same time.

To me it is pretty simple. Capping ECL races at 17, 18 and 19 levels is TOO much of a hit. No one would play them if we are talking from a power/min-max pov.

OTOH if you let them be able to grind out level 20 everyone would play them from a min-max PoV.

What you need is a creative, RP-based alternative solution that also balances things in the min-max way.

I suggest that you allow level 20 for all races.

BUT you then allow level 20s to quest for special, custom gear. However, ECL races become more limited in either the quality or the amount of unique gear they can quest for.

The first part of the post-20 leveling process is usually an automated function that allows you to "turn in" XP at certain NPCs for things such as reputation. Turning in XP post-20 can be used for more than just being part of the unique gear questing process. It can be used to generate the fame needed to get your own house or castle, as part of building up a faction. You can add turning in GP as well to this.

The unique gear (reasonably balanced of course) can balance out ECL from a min-max PoV and add RP points as well. Many fictional characters had certain trademark items etc... And post-20 XP and GP turning in for other effects also really gives a person a reason to keep and continue to play a level 20 beyond just sitting him in town and using him as a foil for lower level RPs.

omgleetgear personally makes me sick of a game

It's why I quit WoW.

ChikenKannon wrote:It's why I quit WoW.

ditto.

and thats not because i was one of the new level 60s, who were getting 1 shot, it was the other way around, and that was boring, and then there were my alts who got 1 shot... either way NO FUN!.. .and worst than ANYTHING - no skill.

No.

EDIT: What they said. Putting in ultra rare/uber items that require massive amounts of effort to aquire and turn you into a small God makes everyone suffer. The only reason it's in those games is to suck people into paying money while they spend time grinding to it.

to elaborate on what i was saying, and why i don't think the idea would work well is because uber weapons should be of NO INCENTIVE to continue playing after level 20

although, there should be above normal weapons people can quest for, but people without them should still be within reasonable power of theirs, as for the drow/etc., simply nerf them, but NOT by taking away their uniqueness, give them their uniqueness, but reduce other things, which i'm sure jay four can find a way of doing

now in saying this, it is a dungeons and dragons game - one in which has dungeon masters, let those level 20s play because the quests will NEVER be the same when a DM is running them, and they will go beyond scripting and repetitivity, especially when the dragon you are fighting is not A.I controlled - a real person is behind it, you can not come up with a strategy KNOWN to work, because, as stated, its not programmed to do the same thing every time.

one day in WoW i could go on a raid and do what i did the past week all over again, with people bitching about loot, but in Dasaria i could go for a stroll through the woods, to find reports of undead being summoned and ordered to attack civilians, and go on a unique quest with friends (not for the items - although, items would be nice as a reward but not incentive to go) to kill the necromancer behind it all, to find out it is an undead dragon that fell from the skies or something cheesy.

Role-playing is its own reward on Dasaria, if you do it just to get a cool items you should really reconsider why you want to play here.

Now that being said people do at times acquire unique items through great amount of roleplaying, however they are unique, not necessarily better than what other people could get on their own in the world.

Yeah, a unique item aquired through outstanding RP in an event doesn't have to even do anything--just having one is worthwhile to me.

Uber gear sucks uber balls. The best way to discourage min-maxing/power gaming is to focus more on the RP elements of the PW.

If that doesn't work, just have a DM change all power gamed characters into lvl 20 bards with 2 CHA.

the gear in this game is uber enough without adding in epic uber gear nuff said.

Respectfully, you are all being extreme. Unique gear does not equal uber l337 gear necessarily.

For example, suppose the server max was +5 on weapons. Someone who was human and who handed in like 100,000 extra XP, 200,000 GP, a bunch of ores or a scale of a dragon etc... AND then RPed out a special quest gets a +6 sword.

OF COURSE there would be limits on what kind of unique gear you can get. But the point here is that in one fell swoop you:

*gave killing monsters meaning for a level 20
*gave accumulating gold meaning
*took a large chucnk gold out of the system helping to limit inflation
*helped balance out the level 20 Drow who say could not get this item - now in terms of min/max humans can get 1 more ab than drow helping to balance out the drow advantages

This will never be a paper and pen game. And there will always be a hack and slash element. There will always be times when a level 20 wants to log in for an hour and chew stuff up and doesn't have time for a long RP session. Servers that ignore this always suffer. And there is no real downside IMO.

Level 20s should NOT have to semi-retire IMO and only be used as RP tools or brought in for special DM run events. There should be a reason to go adventuring at level 20 rather than just sit in town and RP since IMO the best RP is adventuring RP - this is what D&D is about.

Also ignored were other ideas like turning in post-20 XP + perhaps large amounts of GP for:

*housing
*special status as part of RP like becoming a Lord (with attendant name change)
*an RPed out alignment change
*improving the status and power of yorur faction or group with attendant benefits and RP associated

I have seen this done successfully on many good servers where it wasn't about becoming a GOD, just about making the non-RP elements of the game still meaningful for a level 20.

And as for ECL my point still stans - let them become 20 and they are too powerful. Cap them at 17, 18, or 19 and they are too weak. Balancing the races via top-end gear possibilities seems the most elegant solution to me.

You don't get great RP IMO by ignoring all the min-max and hack & slash elements, you get it by dealing with them so that they are no longe serious issues so that then nothing is distracting from people focusing on RP.

You're missing the point, by putting this stuff in and rewarding people for, quest exploiting to get xp really fast, pick pocket chaining and ninjaing through dungeons for gold it's motivating the behaviour that is really bad.

And from what I've read and heard, the system of those who RP more interesting stuff get more chance to do more interesting RP stuff is much more logical.

I mean why screw casual 2 day a week gamers because they can't put in the 100,000 XP quota and 200,000 gold but who CAN put in decent contributions to the atmosphere, story and roleplay interesting and vivid characters?

DMs can always give out large amounts of RP exp to a level 20 or GP - so the casual gamer could purely RP his way to the best gear too.

My point here is simple. This is still a CRPG. The automated stuff like spawns and dungeons and the attendant rewards should NEVER become totally meaningless to a character just because he hit level 20.

Of course RP is the server's focus, but there should be some small mechanical incentive for a rich level 20 with the best gear possible from drops to adventure when DMs are not around.

Do you want characters to max out and have to semi-retire? Should a character eventually become a purely RP device that you only haul out for DM run events? Maybe that is the way it goes, but I'd like to hear an argument for that.

Personally I don't think lvl cap or equip should be what determines a persons race, class or any other choice really.

Levels 18-20 aren't too bad of a hit and if you're a Deep Gnome they have sooo many good things about them not even 17 is too bad when you look at all the amazing things they can become... But even so I would rather let them be 20 even if they are a tad stronger, just make it long and tedious amount of grinding because then it will feel like they've earned their strength over others through working at it a littler harder.