Is Disarm Disabled

Bizael · Post by **Bizael** » Sun Dec 17, 2006 1:33 am

After leveling I picked up the disarm feat and tried it out on a bugbear. To my horror the creature still had its weapon out and swinging even after two successful disarm attempts. Can creatures be set in the world editor so that they simply cannot be disarmed?

Kell · Post by **Kell** » Sun Dec 17, 2006 1:38 am

It was like that in Dasaria1 too, I wouldn't be surprised if it's like that now too. I dislike it, but I understand the reasoning behind it being; sometimes you just don't want PC's to get the weapons NPC's have.

ChikenKannon · Post by **ChikenKannon** » Sun Dec 17, 2006 1:43 am

But you don't get an NPCs weapon if you disarm them. I mean, it would seem logical, when you disarm a goblin it destroys the weapon and noone gets it.

Bizael · Post by **Bizael** » Sun Dec 17, 2006 2:29 am

Aye, the skill description in game is wrong, it just removes the weapon from the creatures hand. I could possibly see creatures such as bosses being tweaked so they couldn't be disarmed but if you completely neuter a feat at least post a sign stating your house rules or something. I just wasted a valuable slot I could have used elsewhere.

Post by **Jehannum** » Sun Dec 17, 2006 3:02 am

We plan on going through and making things disarmable, though sometimes we need to give them good items for balance and they may not necessarily be in the server's best interest to have hoards of them in circulation.

I have seen it work on PC's and the disarmer gets the weapon. I need to test it with NPC's

Post by **Jehannum** » Sun Dec 17, 2006 3:05 am

Also, there is an Open Beta at the end of the server name for a reason. Its because you are a tester here to give feedback, which could have been done without the tone.

Bizael · Post by **Bizael** » Sun Dec 17, 2006 3:13 am

Jehannum wrote:Also, there is an Open Beta at the end of the server name for a reason. Its because you are a tester here to give feedback, which could have been done without the tone.

My bad, it wasn't my intention to offend you. In the future I shall indeed watch my tone.

Totally understandable. However I've had characters with improved disarm elsewhere. When I disarmed the weeapon was simply removed from the creature, not placed in my inventory. Was this something customized for that server or is this the correct way that the improved disarm skill is used? I could have sworn that I used it in the official campaign as well and it didnt transfer the weapon to my inventory.

Post by **Jehannum** » Sun Dec 17, 2006 3:18 am

If it doesnt work now, its not intentional, but rather a "Default" feature in creature creation that we overlooked. We definately want that skill in our campaign, assuming it wont make disarmers the most wealthy people in the empire.

Bizael · Post by **Bizael** » Sun Dec 17, 2006 3:35 am

(nods) I know that it doesn't work in your pwc. I know that disarming npcs in something that you want implement at a later date. My point is that using disarm (the way that I've seen it used) doesn't snatch away the opponents weapon and place it in your inventory.. it simply makes the weapon go away and turns the opponent into an unarmed combatant that provokes attacks of opportunity (unless they have the improved unarmed fighting feat).

This is different from the skill description in game and I totally agree that if it actually gave you an opponents weapon it would not only be a griefers dream come true but some the players wealthier than others. However, destroying the weapon and opening it up for attacks of opportunity is the way I've seen it used. Am I mistaken or is that not the default effect of the improved disarm skill?

xAndersx · Post by **xAndersx** » Sun Dec 17, 2006 2:01 pm

I have a question regarding the disarming monsters and NPCs.

People say it would risk flooding the economy with weapons, but I don't see how? Let's draw up a couple scenarios.

1. Disarm disabled. I kill the monster. If monster has nice weapon, I grab it from its corpse. One weapon per monster kill, as normal.

2. Disarm enabled. I disarm the monster, get the weapon. Then I kill the monster. Still only one weapon per monster kill, right?

3. Disarm enabled. I disarm the monster instead, grab the weapon and then run off instead of killing the monster. Monster sticks around in its cave - just without its weapon. Later someone else comes around and kills the monster and the monster doesn't drop its weapon since it had been disarmed earlier. After a while, the monster can finally respawn with a new weapon and all goes back to normal. There is still only one weapon per monster kill.

So my question is how do 2 and 3 flood the economy with weapons?Unless the weapons respawn in the disarmed monsters' inventories after a while, it seems to me like there would be no difference? Or, is it that all killed monsters don't drop their weapons that they were wielding in life, so to speak? I just want to understand how it works.

Post by **Jehannum** » Sun Dec 17, 2006 4:57 pm

Not every monster drops his weapon on his/her corpse, as we must have some control over that items get into distribution. While I realize that not being able to get the weapon off of his corpse doesnt make "sense" but it is a mechanical aspect we have to deal with.

Also, lets face it the AI on a monster is not the same as a real person or a DM controlled monster. They need a little help to be a challenge, and this often comes by way of weapons or gear.

If someone would test this on a local module and report the results, it would help us out greatly as well as speed up our implementation of the feat in the campaign.

xAndersx · Post by **xAndersx** » Sun Dec 17, 2006 5:51 pm

Jehannum wrote:Not every monster drops his weapon on his/her corpse, as we must have some control over that items get into distribution.

Gotcha! And it makes a lot more sense to me now.

Jehannum wrote:If someone would test this on a local module and report the results, it would help us out greatly as well as speed up our implementation of the feat in the campaign.

I'm not good enough with the toolset (still learning the basics) to try such things, but I hope to be of help some day when I've studied and grown strong!

ChikenKannon · Post by **ChikenKannon** » Sun Dec 17, 2006 5:58 pm

I've tried disarm on goblins (it works) and they don't give me their weapons. I will go and try improved disarm today and give you the answer. I seriously doubt that I will get their weapon(s).

Just tried it on Goblins, no, they do not give you their weapons. It does the same "Their weapon has been destroyed". As normal disarm does.

Post by **Jehannum** » Sun Dec 17, 2006 9:46 pm

Thats good news. I should have most of the opponents set as disarmable in the next day or so

Bizael · Post by **Bizael** » Mon Dec 18, 2006 1:23 pm

Jehannum wrote:Thats good news. I should have most of the opponents set as disarmable in the next day or so

Sweet! Let the attacks of opportunity commence